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Thread: Pheasants Forever- SCAM or do they help upland hunters?

  1. #31

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    Plenty of accusations of cronyism and entitlements from the original post and a few others. If this is all true than PF has indeed fallen into the DU trap. I was a 30+ year member of DU, but left 5 - 10 years ago. The amount of crap that goes on at the DU state and national level among their "party chairs" is appalling. DU certainly lost its way when they decided to support moist soil management projects on private land. This basically helped those flooding land for hunting on private leases.

    In Minnesota the PF local chapters are strong and most of the money they earn stays local and provides habitat improvement (mostly on public accessible land) and habitat acquisition. If they get a little private access because of the local relationships - more power to them. Guess you can join the local team if you want that chance.

    PF strongly lobbies Congress for CRP and CREP. Pretty up hill battle when going against the likes of Big Ag (ADM, Cargill, and the chemical companies). While both CRP and CREP benefit private land ... some of this land also becomes walk in access land open to the public.

    I will continue my $35 donation (with gift) and donating additional higher amounts to specific land acquisition funds and projects.
    Last edited by BRITTMAN; 11-29-2019 at 11:16 AM.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    2

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    I was an enthusiastic member of PF for years. After never seeing any projects or benefits in my region, for which I contributed generously, I am no longer involved. I give a really nice "holiday basket" to the landowners that allow me the privilege to hunt pheasants on their land. I have seen a lot better return on my money doing that. JUST SAYING - NOT CRITICIZING.

  3. #33

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    my daughter just joined so she could get me the current t shirt "Trampled by Pheasants", which is a take off on the popular fast-grass band "Trampled by Turtles"...their lead singer just became a pheasant hunter and is trying to help...again, $35 for a membership...not $350...or $3500....and you get stuff...even if they just help with congressional issues within the farm bill, etc, who really cares? again, $35...just my point of view...a pack of cigs in MN is $10...pull tabs, a few beers at the bar, you name it...whatever...happy hunting! better bet, try to influence land owners to NOT take out sloughs, tree belts, etc...may have to offer $ per gun to hunt their land...which lots of guys bitch about having to do...everything comes with a cost...even offer $100 for real estate taxes...just something to demonstrate that you understand that they have it coming from all directions...that is probably the most significant thing we as hunters can do...

  4. #34

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    Noted on another thread with the ND Century code posted ...

    In ND if a landowner accepts cash payment they assume full legal liability of you on their land. ND Century Code protects landowners from liability if they allow hunters on gratis.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    252

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    I think it is a little embarrassing that a forum like this, probably some of the more dedicated upland hunters there are, are questioning PF.
    1. PF has done a ton for public land, while I can't speak for KS itself. They have turned nearly 200,000 acres of private land into public land in the US since 1982.
    2. PF has done a ton for private land, they have turned nearly 15 million acres of land into upland bird habitat since 1982. Whether that is through a PF biologist helping construct the land, or somebody being lucky with a local chapter donating money. My dream is to purchase a few hundred acres of land and restore it into a pheasant haven someday. You can bet that I will work with a local PF biologist to make that happen. I not only want to sustain bird numbers on my future land, but to help with what I can do to sustain them in the entire area or region. I am not expecting any money from my local chapter to make the purpose or enhancement, but I am expecting some knowledge from someone on how to properly restore the land.
    3. The signs mean nothing. Think of it no different than you are wearing a logo on your t-shirt, hat, sticker on your truck, etc. It's just a logo/marketing/support by a landowner. You can purchase them on their website.
    4. Local chapters make the most noise in the area. In MN, local chapters are spending money publicly. I have no clue on local chapters in KS what they generally do. Local chapters make their money through the banquet and fundraising. Get involved with your chapter and help direct them where the money will go. Our local chapters not only do habitat work, but they recently donated towards constructing a public archery range in a park and towards a fishing pier. I think it is great to give towards outdoor projects that could benefit the youth as well.
    5. 90 cents of every dollar raised by your $35 annual membership goes to "boots on the ground work," not salaries, office work etc.
    6. Like what they do or not, they are positively supporting hunters, habitat, bird numbers. There's a lot of negativity out there about hunters, they do a great job of spreading positive or real things hunting related.
    7. I would highly recommend anyone to listen to the PF On the Wings podcast to get a really good idea of what they do and what their missions are. Episode 29 is a great one that talks a lot about why they formed and answers many questions you guys are posing in this forum. Episode 1 also does a great job talking about how the acquire land, which ones they decide to, and the process of it.
    https://soundcloud.com/onthewingpodcast
    Last edited by jackrabbit; 12-02-2019 at 10:31 AM.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    South Central, KS
    Posts
    567

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    Quote Originally Posted by jackrabbit View Post
    I think it is a little embarrassing that a forum like this, probably some of the more dedicated upland hunters there are, are questioning PF.
    I'm not sure how this is embarrassing - I had always wondered if I was the only one who questioned what their mission was and I see that I'm not alone. Sounds like you're from the older generation where you just accept what your superiors tell you and accept it at face value.

    This goes to show that PF has done a crappy job at delivering their message.


    I reviewed their financial statements and just at a glance would question why their CEO makes appx $360k (2018 reported figures) in total compensation (It didnt specify if that figure includes dollars associated with benefits or not)

    Secondly they are only grossing appx $500k in merch sales? Their marketing team sucks - with Facebook/internet etc they could blow their merch sales out of the water - I'd love to buy more of their items #1 if I knew it was going for a purpose (I've seen Zero proof it goes for anything IN Kansas - which I think by the traffic on this forum and harvest #'s) is one of the top 2 or 3 pheasant hunting and certainly in the top 5 I'd guess for quail hunting destinations in the US - so why so little investment or why are we not getting a message about anything that benefits the public instead of businesses or outfitters etc.


    Lastly again - they suck at getting their message across. I see this as a generational problem - they have guys (based on the CEO and board of directors I looked up) who grew up in the golden age of hunting and before the internet and do not understand the new generation coming up or what challenges they are facing with decreased access opportunities/game etc etc. They'll come on here and say they do but I call bullshxt. The banquets from what I've seen and was involved in is a waste of time and effort. Very antiquated way of doing things.



    I'm still working on building my business and hope to have more things accomplished going into next year - once I get more things built out and myself out of a few tasks I do not like doing I'll have more time to dedicate to causes like this that I'm extremely passionate about. The decline in hunting opportunities and what it's turning into (in KS and from what I've read other prairie states) is extremely disturbing. They can preach this r3 initiative all they want - but if there are no places for folks to easily access with target opportunities they will get nowhere which is where they've been going.

    I dont know if I'd have more luck with an org like this or at our state level or an org like the Nature Conservancy who by first glance at least has the capability to purchase more land than PF does.



    I love the older generation and the wisdom they have but sometimes they need to acknowledge there are different ways of doing things and different viewpoints that will get more accomplished. I say this as someone who will or is already middle age by the modern definition in Feb -- I only hope that as I enter the blue hair phase next I maintain an open mind to new viewpoints and ways of doing things.
    Last edited by KsHusker; 12-02-2019 at 09:18 PM.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    NW Iowa
    Posts
    17

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    Way embarassing for sure. Sounds like your local chapter needs some help. KS, which chapter is most local to you? And is this the one that you were involved in? It doesn't even seem that you are referring to the same organization that we have here. We need to get some input from some of the locals there that do attend the banquits and maybe some of the directors, they can shed the light on these issues you have, their complete lack of community involvement and utter disregard to your hunting needs. Maybe chapters that ARE well supported by the local hunters, conservationists, farmers and landowners, can help you and your former chapter out. Just an idea. I would rather you didn't feel the need to speak so disparagingly about the local PF in your state since they are so active in other areas. Maybe we can change this to where you are on the receiving end, not the giving side. We could all pitrch-in a little.
    Last edited by remy3424; 12-02-2019 at 10:49 PM.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Knoxville TN
    Posts
    30

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    I have reluctantly continued to read this thread. Its premise is counter to all the reasons I joined this forum.

    I agree with points 1-7 by jackrabbit.

    I don't have blue hair in fact I don't much hair at all, blue would be an improvement. I'm truly sorry you have such a low opinion of my generation.

    I don't know a lot about pheasant hunting as I've only done it for 24 years. Don't know a lot about bird dogs either I've only been raising and training Britts since 1978. Many years ago I was associated with QU and watched it morph into a Hollywood mess. I don't see any of that behavior with PF or QF. In fact QF helped me develop a plan for improving wildlife habitat on my farm. I didn't pay for that but I suspect my acreage showed up on a report that supports your position that the money is not helping the average hunter.

    I've not hunted KS that much so I can't address what's happening there compared to other states.

    I suspect PF is not a perfect organization that can and should change, learn and improve as any successful organization should.

    What I think they do really well --
    1. promote this great sport of upland hunting and particularly pheasant hunting
    2. lobby our perfect government to help protect this resource that's so important and is the basis for this forum
    3. the magazine is well done. I enjoy getting it and generally read it cover to cover, cause I usually learn something even at my age and lack of experience
    4. TV shows are entertaining and most often focus on public land hunting. I suspect that more people have started hunting pheasants as a result and I think that's a good thing.
    5. electronic communication (via the internet) is well done

    I choose to continue my support of PF because I believe it makes a positive impact on pheasant hunting in particular, but also other wildlife as well. PF is a very good organization from my point of view.

    Couple of more points. I don't think more land is the answer. I don't have any trouble finding public land to hunt and have enough private land that I gained access to by knocking on doors - don't pay unless delivering a case of homemade jam from my orchards or buying dinner at the local steak house for farmers who have allowed me to hunt on their land without expecting to be paid, is paying - which I don't. If that's pay to hunt, I know I'm getting the best end of that deal and its not even close.
    In the areas I hunt there is more public access now than 24 years ago.
    Never been to a true pay to hunt place - haven't ever needed to. Better habitat is the answer which will only happen through education and smart people working on improvements and that takes a sizeable organization to manage that effort.

    So the question I have is this - If PF vanished tomorrow, who on a national level would fill the void of lobbying state and federal agencies to support and promote pheasant hunting, addressing habitat education and introducing new pheasant hunters?

    I respect anyone's decision to not support PF. Please respect my and others decision and viewpoints, even those at my age, to continue exercising our right to choose to support PF in whatever manner we see appropriate.

    Its really not generational.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    312

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    Like others have mentioned the money raised by the chapter is spent by them to benefit the hunting, and education in their community. If you are not happy with what is going on in yours get off your butt, and get involved instead of complaining on the web. We help our chapter put on banquets, and volunteer to spray noxious weeds on public hunting land in the spring. I’m too old and tired to try to explain it anymore than that.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Monroe Georgia
    Posts
    328

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    Iím old, been working pointing dogs and labs since 1963 and while I use the internet I freely admit Iím no expert. And Iím the head of engineering for a successful company, no need to be thin skinned about it, old folks have better judgment in most things but I freely admit the digital world is not one of our areas of expertise.


    I suspect that they are right about PF management not being ďwith itĒ on internet marketing and they probably should have someone younger managing that part of their efforts.

    What changed since the nineties when pheasant hunting was probably the best itís been since the soil bank days of the 60s? Government mandated ethanol. Until that market uses actual supply and demand criteria and not government mandated rules habitat will continue to be mismanaged.

    I donít see that happening so if I was young and wanted to bird hunting until youíre my age I would move to Idaho or someplace with lots of federal lands. It will take the crooks in Washington a while to figure out how to sell that to their cronies.

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