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Thread: I've got a serious problem here. .....

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
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    Indianapolis
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    63

    Default No Hitting!

    Time to put the ecollar on. Makes for better family relations. Last thing you want is a dog that ducks you every time you make a motion.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
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    St. Croix Co. Wisconsin
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    298

    Default

    Try teaching her that her crate is a safe place, her own quite place.
    I started with throwing one piece of dog food into the back of the kennel in the house and telling him "kennel" each time I'd throw a piece in there, I'd just sit a few feet away and throw a piece in "kennel" let her run in and back out NEVER trick her and slam the door shut, just let her run in and out, do this for a while with treats and toys pretty soon she will just head in when you tell her "kennel" and point, also never put her in there as punishment, again always make it her own place. We also feed him in there, he goes and stands in there at 5:30 every day waiting to eat, half of the nights he sleeps in there with the door open.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Jones County, SD
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    628

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gforcetrivers View Post
    Time to put the ecollar on. Makes for better family relations. Last thing you want is a dog that ducks you every time you make a motion.
    If you don't know what you are doing, an e collar has the same result as beating the dog. It scars them mentally. A dog should never get rougher treatment than a good shakeup, while looking him right in the eye and repeating the proper command. And this situation does not call for anything like that.Think about it, that's the reason you grab your dog by the loose skin around the neck, get face-to-face and look him in the eye while you shakeup. That's the same technique that a dominant dog would use to intimidate. Dogs learn nothing from being beaten, except that you suck.

    I see the proper positive input from others already posted here, so I would just add that you cannot underestimate the power of body language and tone of voice. You have to be ready to go from your gruff, dominant voice, to your "good girl" voice in a heartbeat. It's very difficult when frustrated, but it's one of the most critical factors of dog training.

    Also, dogs do learn from other dogs, both good and bad behavior. If you have a buddy that you can train with. Have his/her dog ride along. Just like people, dogs like to socialize and if your buddies hound has good "kennel" habits, they can rub-off. I have a rescue spaniel that was abused, for 4 years the only way he would load in the truck was with his leash attached. This Spring I got a new female who is gung-ho on the whole dog park, trail running, truck- loading thing. Now the rescue dog usually beats the pup to the kennel. Oh ya, make sure to take the dog to lots of places in the same vehicle you use to go training. Keep her guessing ( Are we going to Dairy Queen? ) If she always has positive experiences related to the vehicle, she will be much more cooperative.
    Last edited by ranchodeluxe; 01-19-2016 at 09:19 PM.
    There's lots of things along the road, I'd surely like to see
    I'd like to lean into the wind and tell myself I'm free......Townes Van Zant

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Odessa, Missouri
    Posts
    248

    Default

    Get a video or two or find a "pro" trainer or someone who has trained 20 or more dogs to help you out. These bulletin boards are great but the one thing they can't do for you is to show you visibly what to do and how to do it. Especially not in 2 paragraphs.

    I'd suggest getting, in no particular order: The Perfect Start/Finish Series, Puppy Development I & II (Ronnie Smith), Training Pointing Dogs (George Hickox).

    I think you can pick between all of these at Gun Dog Supply. One major advantage of actually working with someone over a video is that you get to see the nuanced things they do when they are training. How they pick up on the little things that a dog does during the course of training. Like licking their lips or their head positioning in a certain situation where you can learn a lot. However, the down side is the cost.

    I am no trainer, but I'd certainly say you probably need to start from the beginning on yard work. For a dog this age, my personal preference would be the George Hickox video -- Make sure to get Vol. 1 through 4 (not completely sure it is still sold that way).

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    981

    Default

    Lots of good advise here. It seems to me that at 7 months she is still needing some obedience work. I had a dog retrieving to hand beautifully until one year old then it was like she forgot everything. I took her to a professional and he said think of her as a teenager. They are going to test you and maybe even give you the finger from time to time. He worked with her for two months reinforcing commands. After that she was the most compliant dog I have ever owned. I hate to think what might have happened if I hadn't gotten training help. Give her time and be consistent is the advise I would give you.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Mid Missouri
    Posts
    788

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    Yes an ecollar is the same as a beating if you're using the shock button. Does the dog stay in the house at all? Or is it kenneled all the time? Or does it consistently stay in the same place? And as far as getting your dogs in the box, dogs do learn from other dogs. All of mine jump in the box because the puppies see the adults do it. And even at a young age they try. My dad has to pick his up every time and force them in because he did that when they were young. And ive seen dogs not want to get in the box because they dont want to stop hunting. Easy solve, go on several short hunts, where you are loading them up for a really short time, then letting them out to hunt again within 5 or 10 minutes. Even if you're at the same place just load them up drive down the road, smoke a cigarette, come back let them out and go hunt again. Repeat this 4 or 5 times. That way the dog doesnt think youre done. My problem is the old dog doesnt want to get in the same hole as the pup. Dont have any idea how to solve that one.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    361

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    This is treated with yard work training and never EVER call the dog and discipline her when you finally get her to you. If she need discipline stop calling her and just go catch her, but it is a mistake to ever ever hit your dog. It will never forget it when you do.
    Teach sit, then stay or sit stay on a least. use hand signals and lifting the leash while pushing down on the rump. Once sitting bring you hand topward the face and stop it right in front of the face as if it hit a barrier, then after the dog understands this command back away from her while holding the leash. Do it and stop her every time she tries to come to you the instant she starts to get up. Put her back in her exact place where she was! She knows where she was when you gave the command stay so replace her exactly. ( What you are trying to do is teach her not to move, but if you say the same word and she is in a different place how does she learn its meaning?) Put Her back! Once she graspes the stay command, try backing up slowly and keeping her there. Repeat this daily and keep cessions short, trying to end each one on a good note. Once she understands the sit stay what I do is back away holding the leash and keep my hand out palm up just like a policeman directing traffic. This is body language for stop. In training people in my office at this point I would tell them to look at me and walk towards me, then I would throw my hand up and though it did happen sometimes that aperson would keep coming, almost all of them stopped instantly! It works surprisingly welll with dogs too. So, back to the dog training...
    With pooch at sit stay I would back away with my stop sign out and repeat the word stay and tap them if necessary wiith the lead, then IF they are staying in place I will SLOWLY approach them talking softly to reassure them they are doing what they're supposed to do. ( note : We are much bigger and are intimidating when we approach quickly,so go slowly. If they stay still until you get there reward , reward , reward, but if they have moved you go back and repeat until you can approach with out their moving.
    Now you do this daily as part of their routine, and you are and THEY are ready for the come command. Here's what to do: Get them to sit stay still on the leash then you back away slowly and at the end of the leash you try to squat down SLOWLY< WITH YOUR STOP SIGN OUT> If they stay at sit stay then I poit my finger at then and swing it to the floor right at my feet calling ther name one time and saying come once. They probably won't move because they are obeying the sit stay , but if they don't repeat the come the hand signal and give a little bit of a tug to get them started. Your squatted position is a friendly posture and your voice soft and inviting not shouted. All of this should tak place in a normal speaking tone, ALL of the commands softly! Shouts are intimidating. I generally did all of this with otherpeople's dogs in about fifteen to twenty minutes. Now backj to the dog if it comes on command or even if you must darg it to you , keep your command soft and inviting as you drag, but do drag! When it get to you PRAISE, Praise praise, the praise will be gnuine and the dog will know it! It is worth everything to see that light come on in the pup's eyes and yours too if you could see yourself! Then you repeat this process daily at least or three or so times a day. It takes a dog three weeks to learn something and retain it well. I did this in my exam rooms and space was about four feet of leash. I could teach sit , stay,and come in that space in twenty minutes and build that language with otherpeoples dogs. You can too. Now that you have gotten these commands into the dog's mind you now move to a bigger space and do them , and then to the yard. I prefer to start inside as there are fewer distractions. Once you get sit stay and come down push button, you can go hunting and the dog if it will miind you is way ahead of the game. I really liked Richard Wolters' book GUN DOG for obedience training, and obedience training is obedience training for any breed. I agree also with his philosophy that with oput it you should not take your dog to the field. Different stroke for different folks I guess but I hav had really good results with his methods and they made sense to me. I practiced vet med for forty years and trained a lot of client dogs. I hope this helps you, it is difficult to type all this and I'm sorry it is long but it will work if you do it. If and only if you absolutely KNOW the dog understands the COME command and is just ignoring you... then it may be time to use the e-collar,, but be very sure and condition the dog first as the mfger suggests or you will for sure ruin a good dog if misused!

    I did use an e-collar on my present best ever had birddog and I trained her with a whistle and hand signals. She responds instantly to my whistle, but the down side is She goes crazy if a football or Basketball game is on TV. I'd rather have a good bird dog but I hate to see her alarm when she hears a whistle! She literally runs through the house trying to hide, so I watch other things...Good luck PM me if you need phone coaching I'd be happy to help if I can. Bill

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    361

    Default

    Lots of excellent advice here from everybody... We 're all still learning too, us and the dogs!

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